Reader Participation: A Question For The Comics Retailers Out There.
26 Comments | Posted: February 24th, 2009 | Filed under: Reader Participation, Thinking about Comics Marketing | Tags: buffy, dark tower, the standThis article from Publishers Weekly has me thinking about outreach efforts like this, and I’d really love some anecdotal evidence from the funnybook slingers out there. This quote stands out to me, from Marvel’s David Gabriel:
Again the comic shops have the ability to reach a huge number of consumers as well. Look at the amount of fans driven into stores for the Death of Captain America, the unmasking of Spider-Man, the Dark Tower comics launch, and recently the Amazing Spider-Man #583 featuring Barack Obama on the cover. We’re pretty certain that this book has the potential to bring thousands of new faces into comic shops and from there be introduced to a whole new world of graphic novels.
In my (admittedly very narrow, as I am extremely part time) experience with the buyers that come in specifically for property-oriented works like The Stand and Buffy, I’ve seen a distinct disinterest in anything that’s not those books. My local shop maintains a pull-box just for these customers and even mentioning good, accessible work like Whedon’s stint on Astonishing X-Men or the future-Slayer book Fray when they pick up their books has been met with a collective cold shoulder. Those readers seem to just want their Buffy or their Stephen King or Angel or whatever. Have there been retailers that have been able to to convert these readers into real customers with an interest in the medium at large? What’s their secret?
I was still working at my LCS when all this tv/movie tie-in crap started. It took me 6 months to convince the owner that all tie-in nonsense goes at the front counter, because the Buffy/Dark Tower morons COULD NOT EVEN FIND THEIR CRAP, much less anything else. And believe you me, they don’t give a fuck about ANYTHING but their DarkBuffy.
I don’t think you could even talk these people into Joe Hill.
We even had to explain to a Buffy fan HOW TO READ A GODDAMNED COMIC BOOK! Once the HEROES HC came out, the moron count doubled.
My co-workers and I created the perfect book during all this : “Buffy Kills Captain America on the Dark Tower”. That shit would have been like printing gold!
My experience is largely similar to yours, Kevin. The (few) amount of people enticed into a comic shop for a BUFFY or Stephen King comic will ONLY come in for that comic, and will be disinterested to hostile to the thought of buying any other comic.
I’d actually extend the argument past the media tie-in comics to books that attract “mainstream” attention as a whole. Those people beating down comic-book shop doors for a Spider-Man comic with the President in it aren’t coming back the next week for the newest issue of Spider-Man. We sold an unholy amount of Marvel’s “heroes of 9/11″ comics when they were coming out, but the people who came in for them haven’t been seen since.
Even the most loyal comic readers have preferences that prevent them from reaching out to other types of comics, be they different writers, publisher, and even properties/characters.
While tv shows, cartoons, movies, and yes, even the Joss, will bring in the new customers for their related comics, ultimately it all boils down to the customer’s shopping experience whether they return or not.
As I mentioned, we’ve got them coming back to the point where they’ve set up a subscription, which is, you know, very nice, but cracking that nut and getting them to expand the slightest bit is tougher than it seems it should be. Is it a comics thing exclusively? I understand preferences – I am known for loudly declaring mine to any passerby, given the chance, but I can’t imagine just going into a book store and picking up the new Ellroy or Murakami novel and not having at least a passing interest in anything else.
Maybe the tie-in fans see the comics just as a novelty? Like if Murakami wrote a chick lit novel, I’d go to the chick lit section to find it because I’m a fan of *him*. I don’t know that I’d even look at the rest of the section (and I might ignore it deliberately, if I thought that this was a kooky project in a slumming part of the bookstore but also the only way to get new Murakami material).
Kev, we couldn’t even get the Buffyheads to buy Angel. Most of them told us that if Joss didn’t write it, they didn’t want it. Which made me chuckle after this first arc (by Joss) ended and they kept coming back to buy more Buffy(not written by Joss).
When the new Buffy book came out, we made a disply with all the previous Dark Horse Buffy works on it mixed with the new stuff.
And we didn’t sell a thing from the old trades or comics. Or Angel.
The few Buffsters that eventually bought Angel ONLY bought it after it became “Season Whatever” the continuation of the show’s story I guess.
These people need it to say “season” on the cover. And they call the issues “episodes”.
For reals.
I meant display, not disply!
I think this is likely on-point and is the elephant in the room that Marvel isn’t going to talk about anytime soon.
I’ve talked about this particular phenomenon several times (most recently here and here)…while there is the occasional exception, people coming in specifically for tie-ins to other media (like the Stephen King books), or for character death comics that somehow make it onto the news, really do just want those items. Like I noted in my posts, I’m no slouch at salesmanship…I have been doing this for over 20 years, after all…but it’s an uphill battle trying to get some of those folks to broaden their horizons a bit. Part of the problem is that I suspect a number of these people wouldn’t even touch a comic book save for the fact that there was one tying into their particular fandom fetish.
One side effect is that some of these customers come in with their children, who do want other comics…there’s your breakthrough audience! It’s a long-term “breakthrough” to a new audience, which is mostly introducing those kids to comics reading rather than creating a brand new “gotta be there every Wednesday” customer, but that may have to do.
“I can’t imagine just going into a book store and picking up the new Ellroy or Murakami novel and not having at least a passing interest in anything else.”
In addition to all of the discussion of the comics-only aspect of this … you are more intellectually curious than many other people. Having worked in a bookstore, I know that many people who came in, were there because they wanted Book X and only Book X.
Now, those are not often the people buying Murakami and Ellroy, true. But don’t overestimate the curiosity and interest of your average book-buyer or video renter.
I second Jim’s emotion.
So, I’d have to ask Pete to dig into the database for a real answer, but I recall hearing around the office that people who order Buffy, or even Atomic Robo, don’t really order anything else. Since we’re just a website, I don’t think they’re turned off by the “buying experience” or typical sketchy comic shop appearance (though maybe they just don’t like red?) – I think they just know what they’re there for.
I mean, I’ll walk into a bookstore, and not being made of spare time, get the thing I came for, and walk out again (or at least, would before I signed up for Amazon Prime). I do my deciding of what I want via other means.
I think I’d more or less agree with the “novelty” theory – that certainly sounds like the right explanation for an Obama comic purchase, or a death of Captain America or Superman comic (in the case of the death of Superman everyone I knew who knew I read comics asked me to get one for them… ordinarily none of them would have been caught dead reading comics). I think something like Buffy is a bit more of an identity signifying purchase than a novelty… maybe think of it as an accessory. It helps folks define who they are, and display it like plumage. It’s all about the Whedon, not about “comics”.
At least, that’s my guess.
Oh, and also, if I when I went into a bookstore to get a new Elroy book, and all the other shelves were covered with nothing but novels about nurses (hat tip: Dave Sim), I’d buy the Ellroy book and walk about again. I’m exaggerating, sure, but to the uninitiated there could be a noticeable art form/genre confusion factor at work.
Aren’t the deaths of Captain America and Superman, Spidey/Obama more about supposed investments? In the few conversations I’ve had with non-comic readers who’ve bought these, they eventually mention how much the comic will be worth in the future. Comics still have that speculation mindset among non-comics readers.
@Rob – maybe (well, certainly the Superman case was during the comic-as-investment bubble, but that doesn’t have to be the complete motiviation). I think there could be a pretty fuzzy line between “future money value” and “future novelty value”, though. You know, a octogenarian who voted for Eisenhower and held onto an “I LIKE IKE” button because he saw novelty value in it is going to be confused when the salesguy at Newbury Comics (I know, I know, suspend your disbelief – maybe he’s there buying a DVD for his great great grandson or something) says “I can see you’re into buttons – can I interest you in this Blue Velvet FUCK YOU YOU FUCKIN’ FUCK button?”… because he’s not “into buttons”.
It’s been my experience–and again, I’ve worked in a shop for several years, but that’s only one piece of the market in my area–that outside media tie-ins just don’t bring in New Readers.
Yes, some of the Buffy people were also reading Runaways or Astonishing X-Men, but only the ones who were already reading comics anyway. I’ve said it before, but people who came in just to get the Buffy comic because they were fans of the show ONLY got the Buffy comic, and would look at me like I was trying to sell them pureed babies if I suggested anything else by the same author.
To be fair, though, a few of them DID jump on the Angel comic that had a similar tone (continuing the television series and putting Joss Whedon’s name on the cover as an “Executive Producer,’ as though one can be such a thing in comics), but not nearly as many.
The same goes for Dark Tower, although in that case, the sales (and again, this is only at my store, I don’t know what it’s like nationwide) tanked after the first series. If I had to take a guess as to why, I’d say it was because people figured out that they were doing nice hardcovers–a format closer to what they were familiar with–and that once you resign yourself to waiting six months to get the hardcover, it’s a much shorter step to just not buying it at all.
Ditto World of Warcraft. The first six issues, I could not keep in stock, but when #7 hit, sales literally dropped by half, and have been on a steady decline ever since.
And while everyone already knows this, yes, the people coming in to get Spider-Man with Obama don’t get anything else, but–and Mike Sterling brought this up a while back–they WERE the same people asking me if Superman was still dead and how much that issue was worth. One guy even brought up the 9/11 “HEROES” comic when he was buying a copy of Amazing Spider-Man #583, and asked me how much it was. I told him that we sell it for two bucks, and he seemed really disappointed. But, and this is the crucial bit, it did not stop him from buying five copies of the third printing of ASM 583.
I’ll definitely echo everyone’s opinion on the speculator comics. Even up here in Canada, the demand for the Obama comic was *ridiculous* – but 99.999% of them were people who were sure that baby would be worth a gajillion dollars in the future – much like their still-bagged copies of X-Men #1.
The Buffy and Dark Tower people are tough to crack – and a lot of them don’t. I can’t get the ones who come in once every four months to buy *anything* else – but the monthly folks are a bit easier. A little bit. I started by chatting them up about issue one, what they thought, what I thought, blah blah blah… established a basis of mutual taste, and then started pointing elsewhere. Sometimes it didn’t work, sometimes it did, but in general, I had to wait 4-6 months for this to take effect. Ended up selling quite a few Fray around issue 6, and Astonishing X-Men trades around 10 (roughly, remembering when we started selling out of our shelf copies regularly). Runaways was a harder sell… partly because no one knew the characters, and partly because HOLY MAN, that book never came out… but from there, I’ve only been able to convert 2 of our Buffy folks beyond that.
Stephen King fans are hopeless though. But then again, they think his recent books are good too, soooo…
I’ll back up Brandon on the Canada thing – the LCS couldn’t keep it in stock, and was getting calls from potential buyers up to 50 miles away who were desperate to get their hands on a copy or four. Of the regulars, the only people who were interested were those who were already reading Amazing Spider-Man. Basically, it provided the owner with a one week spike in traffic, filled with people who won’t set foot in the store again until the next speculator’s craze.
I will point out the experience of a friend of mine, who used to be a comic reader in his teen days but had fallen out of buying them for a while (what with a job, family, etc.) As a long-time Buffy fan he started going to the LCS to pick up the new Buffy comics, but then got pulled in by other things and is now making weekly Wednesday trips to pick up a handful of titles. Surely he’s an exception rather than a rule, but perhaps it shows a way that comic stores could take advantage not by trying to convert new readers who come in for these titles, but maybe identifying lapsed readers.
As a lapsed reader pulled back into a comic store by Buffy who now buying weekly several non-property titles, I will second Dave’s remark. Having said that, I have no idea how others like me could be identified, short of casual interrogation at the register.
I’ve never worked at a comic shop (though my wife is trying to get hired at one now, does that count? No? Right, then…), but I wonder if it would be worth sneaking in a free copy of some other carefully selected monthly in a few of these customers’ bags — especially if they seem like they might be anywhere near the proverbial fence.
Obviously this doesn’t scale well, but it could make a difference if you’re a good judge of people and their potential tastes.
I don’t work at my LCS, but I am on friendly terms with the people who do.
Like so many have said, there are people who come just for ASM #583, thinking it’s an investment or a landmark issue. Some show interest in the IDW Obama/McCain comics, but there’s no guarantee they’ll come back.
I did find it fascinating that there was so much interest in what was five or so pages of Obama meeting Spider-Man. Obviously it’s not as high profile, but in Thunderbolts the man’s out and about and in Norman Osborn’s crosshairs, with casual comic readers none the wiser.
Re-reading what I posted yesterday, I apologize for ranting a bit on this topic, but these customers really were a handful (sometimes Dark Tower & Buffy shipped on the same day and then the whole staff would groan)!
Staying on the tie-in topic : how do the SERENITY comics fare for other retailers in the Buffyzone? We actually moved some of that and FRAY to Buffy people; we couldn’t get them to buy Whedon X-MEN or RUNAWAYS at all though.
We also had a lot of sci-fi customers at this shop, who would only buy Star Wars/Stargate/Star Trek/Galactica type stuff.
How are those tie-ins faring for retailers currently I wonder?
“Obviously it’s not as high profile, but in Thunderbolts the man’s out and about and in Norman Osborn’s crosshairs, with casual comic readers none the wiser.”
Thunderbolts #128 was sold out at my local shop AND at my back-up store. They’re going for $10+ on eBay right now.
I will second Dave and Jon’s comments: the BUFFY comic didn’t get me reading comics again, but the BUFFY and ANGEL TV shows did, by reminding me of the pleasures that I used to get from Marvel comics when I was a kid. I think my story is probably pretty common– I was a voracious comics reader when I was younger, gave it up in high school and didn’t read a comic for a decade. When I started reading them again in the late ’90s, I was mostly catching up with the non-superhero stuff (MAUS, HATE) I’d missed when I wasn’t following the form. Watching the early seasons of BUFFY and ANGEL, with their skillful pastiches of comic book tropes and their wonderfully inventive melodrama made me interested in reading more “mainstream” stuff (I hate that term, but I’m blanking on a better one right now, and I hope you know what I mean) from Brian Michael Bendis and Brian K. Vaughn, and from there it was an easy and enjoyable move into Grant Morrison, Alan Moore, Darwyn Cooke, etc.
So, yeah, it might be a lure for lapsed readers. And while this is just anecdotal evidence, I’ve sometimes found that I can get my film and comics students to look at a broader variety of stuff by linking a given title to another pop text they like, be it BUFFY, THE WIRE, BATTLESTAR GALACTICA, or what have you. I honestly don’t know how much that translates to sales, but it does seem to translate to intellectual excitement and exploration, which I hope is a good first step.
Tyler – Ah, I forgot about eBay. Made the mistake of thinking things were the same at every shop.
Here‘s a case of
potWhedon leading toharder drugsother comics.